美告聯電竊密擬罰6,000億 3台灣人最重恐 - 股票

By Hazel
at 2018-11-04T11:55
at 2018-11-04T11:55
Table of Contents
※ 引述《nightwing (內觀自心)》之銘言:
: 1.原文連結:
: https://tinyurl.com/y7ouj6t8
: 2.原文內容:
: 美告聯電竊密擬罰6,000億 3台灣人最重恐坐牢15年
針對股版不熟半導體這塊,必須要發文讓版友了解一下目前產業相關資訊. 不然有些
回推文實在讓人嘖嘖稱奇.
接下來討論的是半導體目前現況以及商業模式,如果想要討論法律相關問題,或是單純
只想要討論美中台關係或是誰是誰非,請左轉出去不要浪費寶貴時間.
郭董想買東芝,看上的是快閃記憶體 (NAND flash), 不是動態記憶體 (Dram).
東芝2001 年就沒做 Dram,有人連這都搞不清楚就不要跑進來和稀泥...
回到晶圓代工這塊,不管 T 也好, U 也罷. 這兩家公司比東芝更早放棄 Dram,
半導體代工是很複雜的.太陽能只要買機台就能做, NAND Flash/Dram 複雜度勝過太陽能,
而晶圓代工難度則是更高.
待過 IC 廠就知道.在 A 公司的設計,轉到 B 公司不可能無痛直接上,轉過去可能就得
要重新設計. 因為每家公司製程能力,元件表現不一樣. 直接套很可能良率是 0.
更別說一些二線 IC 公司,得要斤斤計較製程/光罩相關成本.省一兩道製程或光罩,才能
賺取微薄利潤.
不是每個產品用12吋都划算,電視晶片,車用電子並不需要過於複雜及微縮. 股板前陣子
最愛的被動元件,Mosfet 也是不需要 12 吋,其實只要非常 Low 的製程就能做.
半導體業界很特殊,很多人以為代工是晶圓廠要拜託客戶投單.錯了! 這兩三年所有的八
吋廠幾乎滿到爆炸,時常看到公司業務三天兩頭往晶圓廠跑搏感情,看有沒有機會包到產能.
Foundry 挑客戶量不夠大,毛利不夠高就不給產能. TDDi 爽賺的一波,就有二線廠搶不到
產能沒賺到的哩....
回到 U 如果真的被搞到倒的狀態,除了裡面任職的工程師外,最要擔心的是二線 IC
設計公司,以及原本在 U 下單的客戶. U 的價格就是比 T 便宜,小廠沒的選.
轉到別的公司? 抱歉,前面就講過八吋產能全球幾乎都滿到爆炸.你說擴廠或新蓋廠?
幾百甚至幾千億的投資,很少公司可以拿出來. 就算有好了,等建完廠,試 run 成功,到IC
公司投單,上幾次 Shuttle debug, 經過自己公司的驗證及下端客戶驗證完畢,那時公司
早倒了.
那 T 把 U 買下來? 你就會看到憤怒的川普舉著名為"反托拉斯"的權杖痛毆 TSMC 了~
美光接收U? 那更不可能,做記憶體和晶圓代工差距非常大,甚至連機台配置都不合用.
文末再度重申,此文不是要討論誰是誰非或是美中台關係,只是要讓版友關於 UMC 倒閉
的影響,以及半導體產業粗略的科普.
有問題或見解歡迎討論,不過要吵架,討論內奸或垃圾公司相關,請另開文章,謝謝~
--
: 1.原文連結:
: https://tinyurl.com/y7ouj6t8
: 2.原文內容:
: 美告聯電竊密擬罰6,000億 3台灣人最重恐坐牢15年
針對股版不熟半導體這塊,必須要發文讓版友了解一下目前產業相關資訊. 不然有些
回推文實在讓人嘖嘖稱奇.
接下來討論的是半導體目前現況以及商業模式,如果想要討論法律相關問題,或是單純
只想要討論美中台關係或是誰是誰非,請左轉出去不要浪費寶貴時間.
郭董想買東芝,看上的是快閃記憶體 (NAND flash), 不是動態記憶體 (Dram).
東芝2001 年就沒做 Dram,有人連這都搞不清楚就不要跑進來和稀泥...
回到晶圓代工這塊,不管 T 也好, U 也罷. 這兩家公司比東芝更早放棄 Dram,
半導體代工是很複雜的.太陽能只要買機台就能做, NAND Flash/Dram 複雜度勝過太陽能,
而晶圓代工難度則是更高.
待過 IC 廠就知道.在 A 公司的設計,轉到 B 公司不可能無痛直接上,轉過去可能就得
要重新設計. 因為每家公司製程能力,元件表現不一樣. 直接套很可能良率是 0.
更別說一些二線 IC 公司,得要斤斤計較製程/光罩相關成本.省一兩道製程或光罩,才能
賺取微薄利潤.
不是每個產品用12吋都划算,電視晶片,車用電子並不需要過於複雜及微縮. 股板前陣子
最愛的被動元件,Mosfet 也是不需要 12 吋,其實只要非常 Low 的製程就能做.
半導體業界很特殊,很多人以為代工是晶圓廠要拜託客戶投單.錯了! 這兩三年所有的八
吋廠幾乎滿到爆炸,時常看到公司業務三天兩頭往晶圓廠跑搏感情,看有沒有機會包到產能.
Foundry 挑客戶量不夠大,毛利不夠高就不給產能. TDDi 爽賺的一波,就有二線廠搶不到
產能沒賺到的哩....
回到 U 如果真的被搞到倒的狀態,除了裡面任職的工程師外,最要擔心的是二線 IC
設計公司,以及原本在 U 下單的客戶. U 的價格就是比 T 便宜,小廠沒的選.
轉到別的公司? 抱歉,前面就講過八吋產能全球幾乎都滿到爆炸.你說擴廠或新蓋廠?
幾百甚至幾千億的投資,很少公司可以拿出來. 就算有好了,等建完廠,試 run 成功,到IC
公司投單,上幾次 Shuttle debug, 經過自己公司的驗證及下端客戶驗證完畢,那時公司
早倒了.
那 T 把 U 買下來? 你就會看到憤怒的川普舉著名為"反托拉斯"的權杖痛毆 TSMC 了~
美光接收U? 那更不可能,做記憶體和晶圓代工差距非常大,甚至連機台配置都不合用.
文末再度重申,此文不是要討論誰是誰非或是美中台關係,只是要讓版友關於 UMC 倒閉
的影響,以及半導體產業粗略的科普.
有問題或見解歡迎討論,不過要吵架,討論內奸或垃圾公司相關,請另開文章,謝謝~
--
Tags:
股票
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